$10/hr on Upwork to $100k years as a web designer - Emily’s story!
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Emily started off like a lot of new web designers on Upwork, but she's come a long way since, so if you're looking to see how to transition from Upwork into landing your own clients and commanding significantly higher prices, then enjoy this incredible interview with my wonderful past student Emily. Oh and before we jump in check out her GORGEOUS site and beautiful portfolio - this lady can design!
Emily, welcome! So happy to have you here!
Thank you, it's an honor. I've been, I followed you for a long time even before I ever like really started making any money, so this is really cool for me.
Okay, so let's take it back - before you were a website designer, tell me about what exactly it was that you were doing before.
I had always just worked part-time jobs because I have chronic pain and full-time jobs basically, are just not an option for me. So I was always kind of doing this dance between part-time jobs and photography on the side for a long time. And then eventually, unfortunately, I was not able to do photography either because it was still too physically demanding for me, and so that's when I accidentally fell into web design.
And then can you talk about like what were your first steps into that world or how did you even learn about it, that it was an option?
Yeah, so basically, I think trying to do photography for like a couple of years really taught me a lot about business in general. And then through that, I was like, well, I have to figure out how to make my website.
So that's when I found you and learned everything I could about Squarespace and just building a website that converts in general.
And I was not good at it first at all. But we all start somewhere. And eventually, I got to a point where I was like, hey, I am actually enjoying this now.
And I actually know a lot more about it than I think a lot of other business owners. So when I got to the point where I couldn't keep doing photography anymore, I had to look into other options. I was searching online for like just other things you can do from home.
From that I came across Upwork, which is a freelancing platform so I literally just created a profile and put in every single thing that I knew how to do. And one of those things was, I know how to use Squarespace. So that was the skill that kind of took off more than anything else that other business owners ended up asking me for. And it evolved from there!
And so I guess the first client came through Upwork. Is that correct?
Yeah, totally. Okay, so I was charging, I think at the time, I probably started with like $10 an hour, because I had no concept of like business costs. I was just like, oh, this is like about what I made at my part-time job. So like, that's fine!
What was your experience on Upwork like to start?
Oh, boy. Okay, so it was basically get as many small hourly jobs as you can.
And then, you know, with every single job, I was learning something completely different, because I was working with a different type of business every time. They had different, you know, requests for me every time. And so it was really a learning period of just trying everything to do with websites and seeing what I enjoyed.
And then, you know, after every couple of jobs, I raised my price a little bit. And therefore, I also got like a lot of good reviews on the platform, and got some referrals from those clients. So that kind of snowballed, I would say.
And then through that experience, I also figured out like who I the types of clients I really loved working with. I learned a lot in that time.
And then there was a point at which you don't only get your clients through Upwork anymore - how did that happen?
Something important I should have included here is that after I started doing Upwork for about, I would say, nine months or so, that's when I decided to take Square Secrets Business™ so I could get off of the freelancing platform.
So through that, I learned about, you know, blogging and the power of an email list and everything like that. So I started blogging. And then within like three months, I was showing up in like the first spot on Google for some of my blog posts. So started getting clients that way!
A lot of people think that because I began blogging a long time ago that it won’t work for them nos because everything's been written about. Did you have that feeling at the beginning?
Yeah totally. Because again, everything I learned was already on Google, like about how to use Squarespace. And so it definitely felt intimidating to try to like cut through that competition. But I don't know, I just kind of, I guess I started by looking at what things had I not seen other people even within the Squarespace niche talk about yet or teach on yet.
And then over time, as it got more and more and more crowded, I started focusing on my niche of wedding industry-related web design topics.
And I think that now is my other way of cutting through the noise.
But even without that, my Squarespace tutorial blog post from those early days are still the ones that get the most traffic!
So I feel like there's so much to learn about Squarespace. And so you can always write something in your own way, in your own unique, you know, angle, that people are going to stumble upon it because there's just so much need for it.
And I love also that you said you started getting into sort of like more specific, can you talk, can you give me an example of a blog post that's like kind of Squarespace related, but also like wedding industry related?
Yeah, so a really popular one I have that was pretty easy to do was 15 wedding industry websites that are built on Squarespace.
And what let's see, what's another one like how to create a beautiful wedding portfolio on your Squarespace website, that kind of thing. So it's still, it's still, you know, design inspiration, or it's like actual technical tutorials. But I'm just basically targeting through like keywords, a different audience. So it might be the same kind of content, but it's just targeted differently.
So fast forward to now - how are you marketing your business now, just blogging or other things too?
Yeah, so blogging is so good. It's still something I want to stay consistent with, because I see the the return on that pretty consistently. And then right now, I guess I'll I'll go in timeline order here.
So after I started getting consistent with the blog, I started going on other people's podcasts.
That was really effective too, because I feel like that's the fastest and most effective way to build a relationship with somebody that's literally never heard of you before. So what I would find is it's almost like the same effect as if I offered them like a personal website audit or something like when they would reach out to me, it was as like they already trusted me, they already like knew I had something to offer.
It was very different than the people who were coming in through, you know, Instagram or Google where they need a little bit more time to nurture that relationship.
So podcasts have been great.
And then now what I'm focusing on is my email list, like I've always had it there. But I really want to, you know, dive deep into that now with like, really focusing on more growth strategies there because I love email.
I love that. I love email too. Not sexy, but also super effective.
So coming back to that podcast aspect, who were you pitching to? Or did you hire an agency to pitch for you? I know a lot of people want to know, can they do it themselves? Or do they have to hire a podcast pitching agency?
I got a template from a copywriting friend of mine who already had been on a lot of podcasts. I was like, what is she doing? Like, how do I do this? So I literally just bought her like $15 template or whatever. That's the email that she's sending to people. And it's super easy.
So I mean, yeah, it's really easy to just, you know, tell people like, hey, this is what I think I could offer your audience. Here's why I think it would be great for them. And here's like maybe three bullet points that we would, you know, walk away with or something like that. And so that's that's worked totally fine.
And were you pitching specifically only wedding industry podcasts or just kind of anything? Or like, how were you choosing the podcast that you want to go on?
Yeah, so definitely wedding industry-specific, or sometimes photography, because I also like working with other photographers. But I try to stay within that niche. And if I get invited to a different podcast, and I'm like, sure, that's cool. Still more exposure. But if I'm going to take the time to research a podcast to go on, that's that's a little time-consuming. So I want to make sure it's more targeted.
Okay, and then another thing which I've heard from a lot of class students or like, people in my audience, they often say like, “Oh, yeah, I'd love to work with clients in the wedding industry”. But I feel like they don't spend money on websites. Have you found that to be the case? Have you not found that to be the case? What do you find?
So to be honest, I'm still navigating that and trying to find like the right balance of, you know, packages that cater to those different sub-set of the wedding industry, because I do think the majority of those people are very creative.
They're very DIY oriented, they like the control and the challenge of creating something themselves. And so I have found that even when they don't have the time to do that anymore, or even when they kind of reach their creative limit, they might be less likely to pay as much because they, they have a pretty good understanding of it already.
So maybe it's not quite as valuable to them, as it is in some other industries. But there is a point where you kind of surpass a threshold with like, very high-end luxury brands, or brands who are kind of more getting into the more wedding education space or that kind of thing, where I feel like they want to invest a lot to get a top notch product.
And then and those are the kind of people that are, I think maybe more comfortable with outsourcing in general. So they see the value in handing it over to a professional. So it's a bit of a mix. And it's, it's been interesting to navigate that and to try to find the right sweet spot.
Yeah, you have said something very interesting and different on your website. And it's three very different packages. Can you tell me about what are the three packages? And why did you decide on those three different options?
Yeah, so where this interesting journey that I was alluding to has led me is realizing that there are so many different kinds of business owners with so many different kinds of needs, even just within the wedding industry.
And so what I decided I needed to do was build an offer ladder that you can come in, no matter what level you're at in it's, you know, it's like a $500 workshop that we do together to figure out your needs and give you an action plan. And then from there, you decide like;
do I want to invest more or do I want to DIY?
So it works for people at any level.
So we have the $500 workshop and then we have the one-to-one workshop which is like a strategy workshop. And then we have the website plan where we actually outline every single thing that needs to go on your website. And then again, from there, you have the choice.
Do I want to implement this myself?
Do I want to give this to a different designer?
Doesn't really matter. But you have that all laid out for you. So a lot of wedding professionals love that because again, like I said, they want to do the design, they want to do the fun stuff. But maybe they need like some guidance and direction to know exactly what needs to go where in order to reach their specific goals.
And then after that, we have the website build.
Can you tell me what the price point is on these?
So the $500 workshop takes like two hours.
The website plan is $1,100 and it takes me about a week.
And then after that, we have the website build, which is totally customizable to whatever we decided earlier on that you needed, and the price range varies, but I would say right now the average client is still kind of comfortable with that $5000 and below mark the majority of the time, unless they're like I said, maybe in that higher-end luxury and education space. And then I think most of them are comfortable with around $10k
So many people will look at your site & the sites of others and thing oh, they're all so fantastic. Their websites are amazing. I'm not that good or is the market oversaturated? What have you found? Has that been true for you? Has it not been true for you? What are your thoughts?
Okay, if you're listening to this, dude, the number one thing is not actually your design skills most of the time. I mean, at a certain point, like if you want to charge, you know, like that $10k range that I was talking about, then yeah, that's something that's going to be a high priority for those clients.
But if you just want to get in the game, it's all about relationships.
So whether that's networking in person, whether that's, podcasting, or, nurturing through email, it's literally my clients who have been the most excited and ready to work with me and haven't really even considered working with someone else because they felt comfortable with me as a person and they trusted me.
So that's really the main thing, you just got to show that you kind of know what you're talking about and then be there to support them.
I've seen so many designers in like, you know, groups that I'm in, feeling self-conscious about their skills. And I'm like, dude, the number of designers that I've seen out there, who, in my opinion, their work is just like, not what I would want it not at the level I would want to be at to like start charging for it, but they're doing great. So it's because they, you know, they they have a network of people that that they that trust them.
So you recently had a very exciting business milestone, you went over $100,000 in revenue, which is very exciting. Congratulations - so first, did you ever think that was possible before you started doing this? Or was that not even in your mind?
I don't think okay, so I'm not a super future oriented person. So I don't think I planned that far ahead. I think I was like, hey, whatever, we'll pay the bills right now. Like, I'm cool with that. That's good.
And then can you tell me about what does life look like? A lot of people who are in nine-to-five jobs or started this as a side hustle or whatever it is, they wonder like, what would my life actually look like realistically as a website designer? Can you kind of like paint us a picture?
Yeah, so, A, I wake up whenever the heck I want, which is like my favorite thing!
B, I can take naps and snack breaks as many times as I want.
And C, I've gotten to the point where I will not work past like five or six hours every day!
So that's my, those, I guess those are like my favorite things about it. And it's really, I would say the most challenging thing is just finding the balance between doing client work and doing stuff for your business and finding a good mix. But it's really cool that all of that is up to me. So if I decide I want to take on less client work, I can!
So as you mentioned, chronic pain was one of the main reasons where you're like, I can't just go do a normal nine to five job. How does this work around that? What happens if you sort of have a medical issue?
Yeah, so I literally could not imagine myself doing anything else. Because I have migraines like all the time. So if I get a migraine, in the middle of the day, I can choose to, you know, sleep it off and then wake back up at night and pick up pick up work again when I have more energy.
And again, like I said, it's totally up to me. So it's really like a lifestyle business. And it's completely built around my needs.
And so it's it's meant the world to me!
And the other thing is like I have so much back pain. So even sitting at a desk for too long, which other people would consider easy is something I can't do. So you know, working from the couch, working from my bed has been critical for me.
So all that kind of stuff has been a huge blessing.
Can you share some words of advice for anyone else who wants to do the same thing as you and they're looking at this right now and they're thinking, Okay, I want to be where Emily is in a couple years. How exactly do I get there? Is there any when you look back at your beginner self, is there any words of advice or encouragement or anything that you would give to yourself to kind of get to where you are, but in a faster, easier way?
Okay, so if you have, you know, taken Paiges course and you're like, I got the skills, or at least I got enough of them to like, you know, give them to someone else for like a service, maybe start at like $50 an hour because I think that's pretty standard and normal, at this point, like people are willing to pay that.
And then also definitely do not wait to start a blog, start an email list, and get on a podcast as soon as you can.
And I say a podcast because it can be anything. It doesn't have to be like one with a big audience. And in fact, I recommend starting with ones with a smaller audience, or maybe ones that your friends have gone on, or maybe you have a friend that hosts one, so you're more comfortable.
And then, you know, basically, what I'm saying is don't wait until you think you're like the biggest expert in the world to start offering your knowledge to other people in whatever format that you're comfortable with. But those are the formats that I have seen the best results with.
Can you also say so looking back again, if you were to like, restart your business again, would you start on Upwork again? Would you do it some other way? What would you advise?
I think Upwork has a lot more competition these days, like a lot more. And so I think people are finding that more challenging than it was like a few years ago. So I think the fastest track is to get involved in networking groups. And if you can do in-person, that's the best.
I know for a lot of people, that may not be an option. So you can join a mastermind or a small coaching program, that is also a great way. Because what you find is when you get to be a part of a community, you all want to support each other.
So like, if you have somebody like if somebody else in the group knows that, you know, they have a client who needs someone to do their website or something, they're going to want to send it to their friend before they think of another web designer.
And so I would say that is the fastest way to to dive in.
And finally - what would you say to someone who's currently on the fence or thinking about taking one of my courses, but they're not quite sure if they're actually worthwhile or what you've been through them? What do you think?
Okay, so I could not have built a business without the Square Secrets Business™ course.
And then, you know, like I said, everything I learned about Squarespace itself and building website that converts was also from Paige, and there's a course on that too (that’s the Content + List Academy if you’re wondering!).
So I feel like everything from the client experience to creating your unique process of like what your packages are going to look like, and how you're going to actually deliver that to the legal side of a business. And, you know, the money side of a business that was huge for me to learn all that from you as well. I endorse it - I think it really helped me jump ahead, like by at least a year or two!
